Toddler Ear Tube Surgery: What to Expect – Ep. 266
August 7, 2023
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Laura reports on her 2-year-old’s ear tube surgery, and Shanna talks about having to push through her discomfort to advocate for her daughter. Also, in the special segment “Loose Ends,” Shanna and Laura provide updates on topics that were left hanging in previous episodes, including picky eating, parenting techniques, big feelings, weaning, triggers and more. Finally, they share their BFPs and BFNs for the week. Shanna’s kids are 4.5 and 7 years old, and Laura’s kids are 4.5 years old and 2 years old.
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Big Fat Positive: A Pregnancy and Parenting Journey is produced by Laura Birek, Shanna Micko and Steve Yager.
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Episode Transcript
Laura
Welcome to Big Fat Positive with Shanna and Laura. This week, we have our weekly check-ins. We have our special segment, Loose Ends, where we dive back into the topics of picky eating, parenting triggers, and more. And we close with our BFPs and BFNs for the week. Let's get started. Hi, everyone. This is episode 266. Hi, Shanna. Hi, Laura. So tell me, what have you been up to this week?
Shanna
This week I have been up to some softball drama. It's been a bit of an uncomfortable week, but I've got a report on it, right?
Laura
Yeah, you do. I'm here for the drama. Uncomfortable how?
Shanna
Oh, okay. So as you know, Elle joined the All Star team this summer for her 6U League. And it was built to us as being an intense experience, right? And I knew that we signed up for it. And we've been doing tournaments and practices and all that stuff. But I feel like something took a turn recently with the intensity of the experience. And about two weeks ago, the girls won their tournament, like their division. Like they won the whole thing. They got rings and, you know, it was a whole thing. Yeah, it was very exciting. They played really well and everything. We were all proud of them. And we went to practice the next week, which, by the way, we're practicing like three times a week and then playing on weekends. So it is a lot.
Laura
That's a lot. For a six-year-old, seven-year-old, six and up, right?
Shanna
Six and under, technically, but Elle's birthday cutoff, like the way her birthday is cut off, like she's in the 6U division, even though she's- Okay. All right. So it's like five, six, and seven-year-olds is what we're dealing with here. So it's been very intense. But the first practice after they won this tournament, the girls arrived and the first thing they do right off the bat is get running punishment for mistakes they made during that tournament. And I did not know this was coming. I guess I didn't hear the coaches like warning the girls at the tournament that if they hit the ball and look at the ball while they're running, they would have to run like consequence run at practice. Because if you look at the ball while you're running, you're not running fast enough, right? You're kind of like jogging along looking at the play. So they don't want the girls to do that.
They want them to run hard. I should say that all of the coaches for this are parents and their volunteers. And I like bow down to them for their commitments to this. And I really, really, really appreciate their time and passion and everything they're putting into this experience. But I was caught off guard by this. As you know, and as you know, my style of parenting, I'm not huge on punishments and stuff like that. So I was a little bit like, oh, what is this? So Ellen and the girls are lined up and they have to run from home plate like all the way out to the back of the outfield. I don't know how long that is. Maybe like half a football field or something. It's a one, they call it a 190. So I think it's 190 feet from the home plate to the back and back. And they're doing it over and over. And at some point, like girls are crying because their sides hurt.
You know, when you run hard, like your side hurts, if you're not like a trained runner, I remember that feeling of running a mile in school and being like, oh my God, my side hurts.
Laura
Yeah, mine would happen after like 10 feet.
Shanna
I'm like, oh my side. Yeah, my side. And some girls start crying and Elle, she's so empathetic. She sees them start crying and suddenly she's crying and she's like, my side hurts too. And I'm sure it did. And I'm just like, what is happening here? And then throughout the rest of the practice, suddenly like these one nineties were being instilled for making mistakes on plays, like if they didn't get their glove down or if they like missed a throw or something like that. And I'm just like, wow, this is a level of intensity I wasn't really prepared for. But we'll kind of like go with it. Maybe it's good for her to have some sort of discipline. I don't know. We'll see how she handles it. So the next few practices go on like this. And then last week, we show up for practice right after her camp. We go straight to the softball field. And I'm like, all right, let's hop out and go to practice.
And she starts bawling. I mean sobbing. And I'm like, what's the matter? She's like I don't want to go to practice and my initial thought was like oh I think it's because she like wants to go home and play her iPad instead of like exercising like that's where my mind went so I was trying to like be like look we made a commitment we got to go to practice and I'm talking to her and trying to. coerce her into just like giving it a go. I know it's hard. I see the coach walk by in the parking lot and I'm like, hi, like she totally saw us there. And this went on for like 40 minutes. We were in the parking lot. And finally, because we were very, very early to practice, I should say. So at a certain point, I realized maybe it wasn't about the iPad. Maybe it was about something else. And I was like, what's going on? Just talk to me. I'm here to help you.
And she said, I'm scared of going to practice. And I was like, you're scared? Why? She's like, I'm scared of running 190s. I'm scared of being punished. And I was like, oh, honey. And I'm trying to talk to her. I'm like, that's just a correction they're doing to try to get players to remember what to do when they're playing. And I'm trying to justify it and everything. And she just wasn't having it. She emotionally could not pull herself together to go to practice. And so I was like, all right, well, let's go home. And we'll give you a mental health day. And we'll skip practice. So I messaged the coaches. I'm like, sorry, we're not going to make practice. And even though they'd just seen us there, And we took off and went home.
Laura
Wow. She was traumatized. Oh, poor thing. I feel really like, I feel a lot of sympathy for her because I feel like this was my entire experience with sports in school was basically like getting the joy sucked out of it by coaches who thought that they were, you know, Making me have grit and instead what they were doing was just making me dread every moment of every practice and not want to do it at all Which I really hope isn't the ongoing thing with you guys, but I feel that like I can feel it I this is what happened with tennis for me like oh really Yeah. Tennis was the sport that like my mom decided we were going to play. And we went to like a tennis club and they were pretty serious about it. And I was just like a kid who just wanted to hit some balls and run around. And like I wasn't trying to be a competitive tennis player. Right.
But the coaches were very serious about it and did the same thing. Like if I did something wrong, I'd have to like run laps and go to the net and back and like 10 times or whatever, you know, all that stuff. And. It turned into me just not liking tennis. And it wasn't until I was in college when someone was like, oh, do you want to hit some tennis balls? And I was like, oh, I'm not very good. Like I had all this internalized like a sense that I was terrible at tennis and that I didn't like tennis. And they're like, just come out. I don't have anyone else to play with. And I start like serving and, you know, rallying with this person, this friend of mine. And she was like, Laura, you're good at tennis. That was like. I am. I was like, I am. She's like, yeah. I was like, but compared to everyone else and my coaches are always mad at me and blah, blah, blah.
And like I never realized that I could just enjoy it. So yeah. I'm so sorry.
Shanna
That's so sad. I'm sorry that happened with you and tennis. And that is exactly what I was worried about in this situation. Yeah. I'm like, she started softball less than a year ago when she was six years old. A lot of the coaches we've had up until this point have emphasized having the girls love the game, like getting them to fall in love with it now so they'll want to stick with it later. And that's really what I wanted for her. I knew it'd be more intense, but this was not going the way that I had hoped. So we got home and Steve talked to her about it more. And she specifically pointed out an exercise they did during practice, like where they were practicing their throwing and they had to throw towards a big net. And if they didn't hit the net, they had to run these 190s. And she's like, I'm trying my hardest. And I'm still being punished. Like she's not trying to miss the net.
Like she's focusing on trying. She's learning softball. She's learning to throw. Yeah. And Steve's like, you know, I don't agree with this punishment at all. And I looked at him and was like, what are you going to do about it?
And I was in the room at that point. And I was like, that's a really good question. And Steve's like, we'll talk to the coaches. And I was like, I hate confronting coaches. I don't like that. That's not what I want to do. But we have to, right? We're like only halfway through the season. And I don't want her to quit because I want her to learn commitment and sticking with things. And I also want to show her that I support her and I believe her. So later that night, Steve starts drafting an email to the two head coaches. And I was like, you know what, I feel like this message should come from me actually, because I'm the one who's been at the practices while they're running and like, kind of passively aggressively showing some dissatisfaction with the running, you know, and might be obvious that I'm having feelings about it. And I think maybe I should be the one sending this message.
He's like, yeah, sure, of course. So I finished off his message and put my own personal touch on it and sent it off.
Laura
Wow, so okay, what did you say? What personal Shanna touch was there?
Shanna
Well, Steve is an excellent communicator. Like I trusted this task with him implicitly, but you know, I wanted to make sure that I was like, thank you for volunteering. like we really appreciate you, you know, like this is what I feel and what my kid is going through and stuff like that. And I try to be pretty direct, which is uncomfortable for me to deal with another adult that I'm having some conflict with. So it was a little tricky for me, but I was, I said something along the lines of like, To be honest, I feel like the All Star experience took a different turn when the punishment system started being implemented at practices. You know, of course, I told them about how... Elle like broke down crying and she's scared of practice and all that. And I asked them to reconsider even doing the punishment system at all.
So not only am I like saying my experience, but I'm also asking them to alter their behavior. I'm just like, who is this person writing this message? This is bananas, you know and then thank them both so much for everything they do and told them that you know running for conditioning I totally am on board with but running for like a punishment and is just doesn't sit well with me and I would understand if they don't want to change their methods or whatever. But I wanted to express my feelings about it. And yeah, that's what I sent off. And have you heard back? Yes. One of the coaches wrote back pretty quickly and said, thank you for sharing. Let's talk about this at the next practice. Oh. So mama has to do some face to face conflict resolution.
It's just it's so hard and awkward. It reminds me of when I had to confront that karate teacher that L had, you know, for like being too aggressive in class. Like, I don't want to be telling people the right or wrong way to teach sports, but when it affects my kid, I'm like, yeah, to put on my big girl pants and do it.
Laura
Yeah, and also, I mean, I don't think this is the case with these volunteer softball coaches, but there have been many times in history where people have used sports to shield themselves from accusations of abuse, right? It's a place where there's a huge power dynamic between the coach and the kids and that can get taken advantage of you know so it's good that you are there to watch out and speak up for her. When she really can't herself so thank you when is this practice.
Shanna
It is next week, early next week, and I guess I will have to report on the resolution at that time.
Laura
Okay, well, we'll be cheering you on, and I won't punish you with extra laps if it doesn't go the way you want it to go.
Shanna
Thank you. Thank you, friend. Anyway, that's my saga for the week. What do you have going on in your world?
Laura
Well, we had a medical saga this week.
Shanna
Oh, that scares me. Tell me everything's okay.
Laura
Yes, everything's okay. But on Thursday, little Sebastian finally got to have his ear tube surgery. Okay, tell us everything. So the surgery itself was billed as like a very quick procedure, right? My ENT. He was so nonchalant about it. He's like five minute surgery in out, not a problem. They usually wake up in the recovery room and say, why is it so loud in here? So we were like all prepared for a pretty quick process, right? And I knew it would take time to get admitted and blah, blah, blah. What I didn't know was exactly when the surgery was going to happen until the night before because they literally didn't call me to give me a time to show up till 5 p.m. the night before. Wow. Which was like, ugh. And they said that we had to check in at Children's Hospital of Los Angeles at noon the next day.
And I was a little disappointed by it being so late in the day because I knew there were going to be like eating restrictions because even though it's a minor surgery, he has to have anesthesia and anyone who's had any anesthesia knows they don't like you eating beforehand and all that. So the surgical department that called me the night before at five just casually was like, okay, so no solid food after midnight and only clear, non-red liquids until 11 the next day. And I was like, how about boob? Where does boob play? And they're like, oh, are you still nursing? I'm like, I am still nursing. They're like, okay, he can have breast milk until 8am. I was like, okay, better. Like that'll be a lot better than him waking up and like basically clawing my face off because I'm telling him he can't have his morning boob. Yes, that's a relief.
But I was just like, oh shit, like getting him to noon without any solid food is gonna be rough. So hard. So I had a lot of anxiety about that. Thankfully Corey had to deal with most of it because I had to work in the morning. So he tried to distract him and apparently he was okay. Like there were a couple times he was asking for a snack but Corey was able to like persuade him with a lime popsicle or something like trying to trying to get him distracted. So anyway, noon rolls around, we go to check in at the hospital. And we start going through all the steps like, you know, first you sign in, then you sign in at a different desk, then you get taken to an exam room where like a nurse does all his vitals. And then you talk to another nurse who does like a whole other set of tests.
And then they ask you again, if you have COVID for like the thousandth time, then they send you to another waiting room where you're waiting to be called up to the main waiting room. And Blah blah blah blah blah all of that took three and a half hours. Oh my gosh for a kid who hasn't had food all day and no water either like after 11 I mean this poor baby and he was such a trooper Shanna. Oh my goodness. I'm gonna hear hold on I'm gonna send you some pictures because he was so cute in all like the little exam rooms like they had a They're like exam table in the first exam room set up like a school bus and they had like steps that he could climb up onto it on his own and be independent. And all he wanted to do was climb up and down the bus, up and down the bus. They gave him surgical scrubs, like little patient outfit. I don't know what you call it.
They have little giraffes on them, and he's so cute. Oh my god, okay, hold up, I'm sending you some pictures so you can see. Okay, I sent you a few pictures.
Shanna
All right, a little cutie pie with a teeny tiny blood pressure cuff on. Oh my gosh. Oh, Cory holding him in his little scrub, whatever, gown. He's so cute. Did he know why he was there? What'd you tell him?
Laura
We kept telling him that he was going to get his ears fixed, that he was going to hear better afterwards. I'm not sure how much he understood, but I got to tell you, Shanna, he is like the best patient. He is so, yeah, I mean, like patient is really the key word. He was so patient throughout the whole process. He like just lets the doctors do their exams like no fuss. I mean, so towards the end of the day, we ran into one of the surgical assistants in an elevator and she's like, oh, I remember this guy. This guy was such a good patient. He just laid there and let me do whatever I needed to him, no crying or anything. So, you know, that's a bit of a spoiler of the whole thing, which is like, finally, finally, finally, he gets called in and the surgery went totally well and all the doctors and nurses and everyone were just like, he is the best patient.
And the doctor was like, oh yeah, he wins the prize for best patient today. He just, he just let me do what I needed to do and no complaints. He didn't get a nap either, by the way, this whole day. Oh, yeah. So it took him a while to come out of the anesthesia. And the nurses were like, huh, he's still sleeping, huh? I'm like, guys, he usually takes a 90 minute to two hour nap. He didn't get his nap today and you just knocked him out cold like he probably thinks he's gonna sleep for like at least another hour Yes, what time was it at that point? So it was 4 30 at that point and Cory had had to like run off to get Augie because we had like gotten extended care for the day for Augie thinking like there's no way we'll still be there at 5 but alas We were. So like he rushes off to get Augie and like bring him back so he can pick up Sebastian.
Like, that was a little bit of stress because, you know, like I did not expect a five hour surgery for something that the doctor had billed as five minutes.
Shanna
Yes.
Laura
I'm going to send you a picture of him in recovery. Obviously, I'm not going to post this on the internet because you know, he's unconscious, but I want to show you sort of what he looked like. in the recovery room, passed out taking his nap finally. Oh my gosh.
Shanna
Oh, a little sweetie pie with his little oxygen mask strapped on. Probably taking the best nap of his life.
Laura
Yeah. I mean, his heart rate was nice and calm. But anyway, so he starts sort of stirring out of this state. And the nurses really wanted him to wake up because that's part of the whole process of getting him to go home, right? Yeah. And he's stirring, and the nurse, he's like, Hey buddy, do you want a popsicle? And he's still like, his eyes are closed and he's still like, like not really responding. And I say, baby love, it's mama, do you want boo boo time? And he bolts up.
And he starts, like, ripping his gear off his body. Like, you know, like someone who's trying to leave the hospital against medical advice. Like, he's, like, trying to take his, like, the electrical leads off his chest. He takes his mask off. He's like, Boota, Boota. And the nurse is like, well, that got his attention. I'm like, yeah. He likes it. So we nursed him and they were like, oh, only clear fluids for the first hour. And I was like, what about nursing again? They're like, oh, that's considered a clear fluid. I was like, great. So I nursed him and he was so happy. I thought it was really funny too because everyone was trying to give me all this privacy when I was nursing him. They're like, oh, the doctor needs to come and do a follow-up. But you're nursing. I'll give you a second. I'm like, guys, I've been doing this a really long time. I can talk to a medical doctor.
Shanna
They don't know your nursing history.
Laura
I guess not. Yeah. I mean, they could probably guess based on the fact that Sebastian's almost two and a half and I'm still nursing, but I appreciate the privacy concerns, but he did really, really well. I'm going to talk a little bit more about it in my final segment, but I will say here, I'm going to send you a picture of pure bliss.
Shanna
Okay.
Laura
The timestamp on this is 5.43 p.m. So it's basically 23 hours since the last time he ate.
Shanna
Oh, baby. He's got some nuggets, some french fries.
Laura
Is that a little happy meal? It is a little happy meal. He got a happy meal. He destroyed that happy meal. Like usually he'll eat two nuggets and kind of leave the rest like no he ate the whole happy meal and some more of my fries and yeah.
Shanna
Okay so it looks like he recovered pretty well and bounced back from having surgery. Were there any like other kind of downtime or I don't know recovery issues?
Laura
No, Shanna. I had heard from other parents that, like, oh, they're going to be really sleepy that day, but the next day they're going to be back to normal. I'm going to send you a video from bedtime that night, 7.30 p.m. after this child who didn't eat all day, 24 hours almost without food, and was sedated less than three hours before that. All right. Let's see.
Shanna
Oh, my word. Okay. He has got a cape on. He is. running in circles with a Captain America cape. Oh yeah, he's no worse for wear.
Laura
Yeah, I mean, truly you would not be able to tell anything had happened. So I'm happy to report that continued for the rest of the week and he is right as rain.
Shanna
Yay, great. I'm so glad it all went well, and you were able to get in and get that surgery sooner rather than later. Okay, one more question. Is he hearing better yet? Is it an instant thing? Are you able to tell?
Laura
You know what? It's hard to say because he hasn't shown. It's not like he immediately started speaking in super clear sentences or anything or saying he's hearing better. But he still has to get ear drops for the next five days, so maybe it's just something that needs to like the ears need to heal first, so we'll see. Okay, but anyway, yeah, that's it for me this week. Shall we move on to our special segment? Yes, we should.
Shanna
We're back and this week's special segment is Loose Ends where we give some updates on topics we left dangling in previous episodes. Laura, I'm gonna kick it right off with a question for you. In episode 247, you talked about going to a cooking class with Augie and he like mowed down on an avocado or maybe more than one. So I'm dying to know, is he still eating avocados?
Laura
No well not in the few times we've tried he has requested avocados and I've bought like three or four of them at this point cut them open put them in front of him and he's just left them there so. Yeah, I'm not like spending a bunch of money on more avocados for that to happen. If I happen to be like slicing up avocados, I'll tell them about it, I think. It was definitely not like a, you know, slam dunk, I'll say. But I will say he has continued to like randomly request and try new things. That's good.
Shanna
For listeners who might not remember, Augie has a history of some picky eating.
Laura
Yes, he's a very selective eater. I've realized that a lot of it stems from anxiety. Like he really needs to feel in control. And I think he's like, you know, he really needs to know that he can control what's going in his mouth. I think he has a very strong sense of smell. So I think that that's part of his aversion to a lot of foods, you know, it has to be just right for him and a lot of its control. But one thing that happened recently on our trip to Portland actually, is that we went to this Chinese restaurant that's like near my mom and stepdad's house and they're total regulars. And Augie was willing to try new things, especially, so he's had orange chicken before, but it's been a while since he's eaten it. And he absolutely like destroyed the orange chicken at this place, which I've realized they're kind of just like pre-sauced chicken nuggets with sweet and sour sauce.
Shanna
It's not too far off, but it comes in a different form. It looks and smells different, so kudos to him for branching out. Exactly.
Laura
And he tried a Mushu pork wrap? Like he ate a couple bites of the wrapper and then ate a bite of the inside decided he didn't like it, but that's okay. And he asked for rice, which most people who have kids who eat typically would not be excited that their child asked for white rice at the table. But he has not touched rice for at least a year, maybe longer. But the fact that he asked for some rice, like he asked me if I would move the lazy Susan around and like put it on the plate was huge. Took a bite, decided he didn't like it, but I was like, that's fine. That's fine. He asked for it. You know, like he's actually branching out and trying new things. So, I just feel like only parents of picky eaters will understand the elation of being like, he tried white rice. It should not be that exciting, but it was, it was. Oh, well, that's good.
Shanna
That's great news.
Laura
Yeah. Okay. So I've got a question for you. Okay. Okay. In episode 244, you talked about going to CECE's preschool and going to like the assembly where she's saying all these songs about God. Ah, yes. Is she still singing about God? Is that still happening?
Shanna
Um, she sang about God all the rest of the year, and they did their little chapel performances every month. School is over now, but she is doing summer camp at that school. And I don't know if you remember, but in that episode, I was talking about how, like, when we toured the preschool, I specifically asked, like, will there be religious teachings here, you know, because we're not religious. And they were like, no, no, no, we'll just like sing about kindness and stuff. And so the God songs were like, oh, interesting. OK, unexpected, but whatever. So we're in summer camp now. And I went to pick her up the other day at 12.30, because I pick her up early. All the other kids are staying there. But I pick up CECE. And as we're walking out, I hear the teacher say to the other kids, OK, let's do our prayer before lunch. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa. interesting.
I didn't know we were doing prayers actually in the classroom now. So I decided to talk to CeCe about that and see what the deal is with it. So I asked CeCe, hey, do you guys pray at summer camp? And she nonchalantly is like, mm-hmm. And I'm like, oh, what do you pray about? And she said, I don't know. And I was like, mm, do you pray about God? And she goes, mm-hmm. And I was like, oh, you do. You pray about God? And she goes, yeah, and pirates. So I don't know what's going on over there.
Laura
God and pirates, yeah, unreliable narrator there.
Shanna
Yeah, yeah, it was like pirate theme week. So they did like some pirate crafts. And so this whole conversation led me to believe that she doesn't even really know what praying is or God really. So I'm continuing to be like, okay, whatever, like we've got a few more weeks there, then she's gonna go start at her public school. And I won't have to think about it anymore, but that's where we are. All righty. All right. Next question. In episode 252, you reported that Augie had successfully weaned from breastfeeding at the ripe old age of four and a few months. So what's the status of that? Is he still weaned or is he still craving the boo boo time?
Laura
Oh yeah, he's definitely weaned like I'm not backtracking on that. That was okay. That was a long time coming. I was more than ready for that. So, and you know, he was too, if you remember, it was like a very slow process and he was like forgetting most days. So it's fine. But there have been so funny. Like, he definitely remembers and he will occasionally say something about being sad, about not doing it anymore. Oh, really? Yeah. Like, every once in a while, he'll come up to me and he'll be like, I'm going to pretend to do boo-boo type. And I'm like, what? And like, before I know it, he's just like sticking his face on my boob and like making like a cartoonish like eating sound for like a second. And, you know, I'm trying to be very neutral about it, because I don't want to give him a complex, right?
Like, I don't want it to be like, that's weird or that's gross, just being like, okay, you know, it's just like what it is. And he doesn't do that often, but it's just like interesting. It just kind of like comes over him. Like the other day, he was just kind of like looking at me sadly as Sebastian nursed. And he was like, not saying anything specific, but I could tell he was sad. And I was like, Auggie, what are you thinking about? It's like, boo boo time. I was like, oh, are you sad that you don't do boo boo time anymore? He's like, I know. So like, it's a little fresh on his mind, but, you know, he's fine. I mean, they're just really passing moments. And I think otherwise he's just living his life and is totally fine.
Shanna
Good. Do you see weaning Sebastian anytime in the near future? Are you going to kind of let that run its course the same way?
Laura
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I don't know if I'm going to let it run its course the exact same way, but I'm really glad that I was still nursing him up until the surgery, for example, because it really gave him a lot of comfort. It allowed him to have a little bit more nutrition up until like 8am that day, you know, and it just I think was really comforting for him. And it woke him up out of that deep sleep. Exactly. What else was I going to lure him out of his anesthesia fog with? But yeah, I mean, I'm definitely thinking about it now because like I'm kind of done, you know, but I'm also like scared of being done done because it's like, it's been the last four and a half years of my life. So like.
I don't know if it's going to be like hormonally a nightmare to wean or it's going to be hormonally better or what's going to happen to my body and what are my boobs going to look like and all that stuff, you know? So I'm definitely not rushing it because I'm just like, I don't know. That seems like a lot of work and seems a little scary. So let's kick that can down the road a little bit.
Shanna
Gotcha. That makes sense.
Laura
Yeah. Okay. So speaking of softball drama, you reported a while back on CECE's major meltdown at the end of season softball party that you were throwing for the team. But aside from that one meltdown, how did the rest of the season go for her? Like, I feel like we didn't hear much about it after the first couple practices. And do you think you're going to sign her up for the next season?
Shanna
Ooh, yeah, good question. I kind of glossed over what the actual season of softball with CeCe as a four-year-old was like.
Laura
Yeah, because if I recall, the very beginning was rough, but then you asked her if she wanted to stay in and she said yes, and so you decided to like stick with it, right?
Shanna
Yeah, she wanted to stay with the season. She ended up playing the full second game after we had that conversation with her. I was like, what a great turnaround. Like what a brilliant act of parenting on my part and discussing it with her. And like, wow, that did not stick. Oh no. Yeah. She showed up to most practices and refused to participate most of the time. Wow. At practice. And I let it go. We had an awesome coach, Coach Rick, who was just totally on my side and on board with just being like, let her do what she does. It doesn't matter. So we just kind of let her do nothing, sit on the sideline, eat snacks, whatever. At games, she liked batting. She would almost always go up and bat, would never go in the field. She just refused to play in the field. And that's half the game. It is, yeah. So she would sit in the dugout. I was a team mom, so I was in the dugout too.
She would just sit in there. usually eating snacks or whatever. And that's pretty much how the entire season went. I did not think I was going to sign her up for the fall because I was like, she's not ready. She was like the youngest kid in the league at four years old. And she would only be four and a half-ish. But I asked her, I was like, hey, do you want to play softball in the fall? And she gave me an enthusiastic yes. And she said, I am even going to play in the field the whole time.
Laura
Wow, OK. Did you get that notarized?
Shanna
I should have. How quickly she will forget. But she's very jazzed up by watching Elle play, you know, the All Stars and go into these tournaments. And she wants to be involved. I told her I would get her own cleats and face mask now that, you know, she's a little older and she's excited about that. And we did it. We signed her up. So we will see how it goes this time around.
Laura
Okay. I'm sure you will keep us posted.
Shanna
Yes, I will. All right, next one for you in episode 255. You were talking about Sebastian having big anger outbursts and tantrums and lots of frustration. And I'm wondering if that's still the case or if it's resolved itself or where you are with that.
Laura
You know, he's actually doing better. He isn't having these like really huge mood swings. You know, I feel like he's kind of stabilized. I don't know. You know, with two year olds, it's kind of like an up and down kind of situation. Like they'll go through growth spurts or something and they'll just be like complete wrecks for a week or two. And then there'll be like two weeks of just being like little angel babies. And you're like, I don't even remember when they had tantrums. He's in a, like, kind of a smoother phase. What I will say is that when he gets upset, he goes big, you know? Like, it's not just like, oh, I'm a little upset. I'm going to let you know. I'm going to cry a little. It's like throwing himself around, throwing his head back, trying to scratch you, like trying to, like, lash out at you.
That's a lot of, like, what would happen in the middle of the night when we were having trouble with his sleep and, like, I would tell him no boo-boo is, like, he would like get so mad he'd be like throwing his head back and like I'd be afraid I was gonna drop him and he's like scratching at my face trying to just like just so angry and like it's something I now have come to sort of realize is like oh his his angry is like a big mad you know he's like big mad and trying not to judge that intensity because I don't think I was allowed to have big feelings like that as a kid And my instinct is, you know, obviously it's never okay to hurt anyone else or try to hurt anyone else. And we're working on that. He hasn't been biting, which has been really a nice change. That's good. But what I'm realizing is that like his mad is real mad.
And I have to just accept that and try to make sure it's like a safe. situation for everyone, but he's allowed to have his big emotions. He goes zero to 60 very fast, you know, and then back down to zero again. And it's like, he's adorable again.
Shanna
That's good. Yeah. Well, that's great that you're allowing him to have his feelings. He'll be better off for it if he can express all that energy and then just move on from it.
Laura
Well, it is also just really useful for me and Corey to realize like, oh, he's he's mad. This is his version of mad. He'll be OK again soon, you know, like not like, oh, my God, what's wrong with this kid? You know, like not catastrophizing it. So yeah, that's where we're at. All right, I will say though that he is doing like proto whining, you know, like he's kind of like learning how to how to whine a little bit and his like his wine face is the funniest thing. He just throws his head back and makes this dramatic.
I was like, oh, life is hard, kid, huh? You really want that thing. But yeah, he's good. Oh, good. Okay, Shanna. So in episode 245, you talked about reading the parent effectiveness training book, the one I recommended and have not read, still to this day. Oh, yeah, we were supposed to do a book club about that, Laura. We were, we were. You know what? To be fair, Corey took it off my nightstand and he was reading it. So I forgot it existed, to be honest. But have you continued to use any techniques from the book? Have you learned anything that you'd like to share with us?
Shanna
For a while, I forgot that I had even read it. That's just what I do. I consume things like books, movies, TV, and it just exits my brain like it's a sieve. But I recently remembered to use some of the techniques. So two of the things it talks about in the book is one, like how to approach problems that are more like kid centered, like if your kid is having a problem with someone at school, like it's not really my problem, right? If it's their problem. In those instances, the author suggests using active listening, kind of repeating back what your child is saying, really acknowledging the experience and letting them kind of come to their own solution. And the other type of problem that you might encounter with your child is more of like a you problem. Like you need your child to change their behavior in some way. Like how do you talk to your child in that instance?
And that's more of like sitting down with them. explaining how you feel, like how their behavior is making you feel, and coming up with some kind of brainstorming list and working together on a solution. I've been using both of those techniques, depending on what Elle is going through. They don't work with Cece at all. The girl will not let me talk about feelings or anything at all. She's just like, no! So I don't use it at all on her. But Elle, it works great. Recently, we've had a big problem with pad time. It has gotten just way too much. I mean, she had a stint of being sick and was playing on her iPad for hours a day. And I kind of like let it go because she was sick and I was like, oh, whatever. And we never really reigned it in. And she kind of got addicted to it and was just like instantly wanting to play it first thing in the morning.
And as soon as she got home from camp and I was like, no, no, no, this has to change. So I sat down with her and I told her, you know, when you play too much pad, like it's affecting your brain and your feelings and stuff. And I really think we need to figure out a plan going forward that's better for the family. And talking to her that way and drawing her in is like a collaborator on coming up with a solution. it's just so much more effective than being like, new rules for iPad, you know? Just like demanding it of your child. And we made a big brainstorm list. I was like, what can we do? Like what are some hours? Like how many hours a day do you think you should use your pad? How many hours a day do I think you should use your pad? We wrote it all down. And then we went through one by one and talked about each solution and circled the ones that we thought would be good for both of us.
So we came up with a plan that like because it's summer, she's allowed to play her pad one hour a day during the week and two hours on the weekend. We just came up with like a bunch of different solutions and we were like teammates on it. And that was I want to say like three weeks ago and She's pretty much stuck with it and I've stuck with it and we told Steve about it and he's stuck with it and yeah, it's really really helpful.
Laura
That's cool. It sounds like the book might be a little more useful for like a slightly older age group right like L's age group and up then maybe our four year olds.
Shanna
I think it could be helpful with a four-year-old if you have someone who's open to it. Because I remember doing something similar with Elle when she was maybe three or four. We were having trouble with her bedtime or something. This was before I even read the book. It was just, I don't know, an idea I got from somewhere. And we sat down and made a list, and she gave her brainstorm ideas about bedtime. She was, I think they can totally be open to it. It just depends on the temperament of your child, I think.
Laura
Fair enough, fair enough.
Shanna
Okay, last question. I think we could maybe both answer this one. In episode 252, our big topic. was parenting triggers and we identified our individual parenting triggers and how they affect us. So the question now is, Laura, have you changed how you approach parenting now that you've identified your triggers?
Laura
Yeah, I'd say I have. I feel like just naming something as a trigger has been really helpful in like diffusing situations. Like, and also identifying what was a trigger and what wasn't when we were talking, you brought up how being late. was a trigger for you and I was just like, oh my God, yes. And so now I've recognized it. I'm like, okay, I'm being triggered because my anxiety is triggered because I'm anxious about being late and it's not because of anything else. It's just because of that. Take a breath. It's okay. It's okay to be late. It's okay to be late. It's okay to be late, right? Yeah. And also just like the other day, there was a bunch of cross talk happening, like people just talking over each other. And I was just like, hey, guys, I need everyone to stop talking for a second. Mommy's feeling really overwhelmed. And like just identifying it is like, that's the problem.
It's not that it's so easy to think it's like everything else, right? Or like someone else's problem. But when you're like, oh, no, no, no, this is just one of my triggers. It's just one of the things that like makes everything harder. And like saying it out loud kind of takes away the power. So yeah, I definitely have. How about you?
Shanna
That's so great. I'm glad that that has been the case for you. I think that in some regards, I've had the same experience, like the being late thing, like naming that has been big for me. I still don't love being late, but I try to think about like, okay, this is a trigger, right? This is why my anxiety is spiking. and being a little more aware has been very helpful. And the sound thing, like just lots of noises all at once was very triggering for me. It still is, but I think it's helping me to be aware of it and do what I can to minimize that. I will say I haven't been so great about being aware of my trigger of sibling conflict. That one is still really tricky for me. Just, oh, when they start getting mad at each other, I just, I'm like, ah. So maybe this is a cue for me to start being aware of that one and maybe I can help myself out with that.
Laura
Yeah. That's good. Well, I feel like we wrapped up a bunch of loose ends. We tied them in a nice little bow. Very pretty bow. We did. We could be professional gift wrappers. Not me. Never in a million years. I'm terrible at gift wrapping. I am good with string though, so But shall we take this thread? Snip it take a little break and come back with our BfP's and B events. Oh, I think we should
Okay, we are back and we close every episode with a Big Fat Positive or a big fat negative from the week. Shanna, BFP or BFN?
Shanna
BFP. Yay. Despite all the softball drama going on, one thing has been going very well, and that is Elle's musical theater summer camp. And yeah, so the last three weeks she has been learning the musical Annie and this weekend it was the big performance.
Laura
Did the sun come out tomorrow? It did. It did.
Shanna
Oh my gosh.
Laura
You missed a joke. You could have said bet your bottom dollar.
Shanna
Oh, yeah. Man, I'm so slow. I'm so slow. Such a good cute little musical. So it was very adorable. It was in like this auditorium gymnasium multipurpose room at this School and the kids it's like ages six to maybe 14 I guess and it was just oh my gosh It was just so cute and it's really impressive that they pull this off in three weeks They learned I don't know like eight songs all the lines L had her lines that she said and And she had her little singing solo, which was just the line, but she was so proud of herself and you could see it on stage, right? She just came out and she like saw that we were there and she saw CECE sitting there and was like waving at her. It was just adorable. Super cute. Let me, let me send you some pictures.
Laura
Yes. Oh, look at her little orphan girl with her pigtails looking so proud of being up there. Oh, and she's got some flowers. That is so great. So cute. I'm jealous. I'm like, I'm surprised by the feeling that's coming up inside of me, which is jealousy. Like I want to go to the three week like musical theater camp so badly.
Shanna
Girl, I feel you. I feel you so hard. Like my kids are always doing like all these awesome fun things that I want to do and especially musical theater camp. Oh my gosh. And we've all been singing the songs all around the house. One really cool thing is that we brought CeCe to the performance and I didn't know how she was going to do with that. And as far as I know, she's never sat through an hour long show of anything. And I was like, I'll take her this year. We didn't bring her last year to Shrek. And the director invited all the young kids to come down and sit on the floor up front if they wanted to. All of us parents were just in folding chairs. And I was like, CECE, do you want to go sit up front? And before I could even finish that sentence, she was like, zing.
Laura
She was gone. She was gone.
Shanna
After a few minutes, she came back. She was unsure. And I was like, it's OK. Sit over there. And I can see you. And you'll be close. You'll be able to see everything.
Laura
Yeah.
Shanna
She was the most captive audience. I couldn't believe it. Every time I looked at her, she just was staring at stage. She was waving at Elle a lot.
And afterwards she was singing the songs. We went in the backyard like when we got home and she like took pool noodles because we set up our little above ground pool. She took pool noodles and like created a stage and was like, you guys sit here. And hold on, let me go get the thing. What's it called? The paper thing? And I was like, oh, the program? She's like, yeah. She went and drew a program, gave it to us, went backstage, which was under the pool tarp, which we had just flung over the fence. That was her backstage, and made us sit there as an audience while she went through and performed everything she could remember from Annie. She was singing little songs and acting out Annie. And I was like, wow, I had no idea it had such an impact on her, but that was really cool to see too.
Laura
Sounds like someone is headed towards musical theater camp next year.
Shanna
Yeah. If she's old enough, I don't know if she will be, but when she is old enough, we'll sign her up. But all in all, it was super fun. They take a week off and then Elle's going to go back to musical theater camp for another three weeks and put on grease. So very excited.
Laura
Ah, Grease Lightning. All right.
Shanna
Yeah. Yeah, Elle already told me that she wants to try out for Sandy, the main lead character in my story.
Laura
I love her confidence.
Shanna
You go for it, girl. Yeah. I know. I know you go for it. So yeah, super fun weekend with that. What about you? Would you have a BFP or a BFN?
Laura
I also have a BFP. Ooh, OK. And mine is that CHLA, Children's Hospital of Los Angeles, has made it their like waiting rooms and experience for kids who have to be there like so cute and fun. I was just like blown away by how much detail they put into making it like a like a comforting and fun place for kids to be when they have to come in and have these like scary surgeries and stuff. In my check and I talked about how long we had to wait, right, before he got pulled into his surgery. But what I didn't talk about, because I was saving it for this segment, was all the stuff they had to keep them occupied. We brought the iPad because we were no dummies and we knew that would need some help waiting. But honestly, we barely had to use it because the waiting rooms were so entertaining for for him. What did they have in there?
So the first little waiting room we went into had all these toddler toys and like trucks and stuff he got to play with. Then we went into like a second waiting room, which was like the bigger surgical waiting room. I'm going to send you some pictures.
Shanna
Okay. Oh, look at him on the bed. He's got a bunch of trucks that he's playing with, like a giant, I don't know, trash truck or something in a toy stethoscope, obviously. Oh my gosh, that's so cool, they provide, wait, is that, what is that, a foosball table? It's a foosball table, Shanna. Oh, look at him, he looks so little next to that table. I bet he had so much fun just like playing with that.
Laura
He did, and you know, he was very focused on it. He was really trying to get the ball like underneath the little foosball guy's feet. So that was very cool, yeah.
Shanna
Oh really, I'm amazed he could even see it. He looks like he could barely see over the edge of it.
Laura
Barely. Yeah, barely.
Shanna
Oh my god. A straight up video game. What is that? Like a PlayStation?
Laura
Yeah, I think it's a PlayStation. Honestly, Cory ended up playing the PlayStation for like a good 20 minutes at some point. Oh, okay. So that one's for the dad. So, okay, okay. Well you know like there are teenagers who also have to wait right so that's why there's cruise ball and the video games but honestly Sebastian was living his best life like full-on living his best life in the waiting room and then so.
So that very first photo that you were talking about is actually when they pulled us upstairs, but we were waiting upstairs to like actually go into surgery, right? And that iPad he's watching is actually like the hospital's iPad. And like a representative came over and asked what he likes. And I said, oh, he likes trucks. And she's like, OK, I got you. And she brought this trash truck over. And so at that point, they gave him Versed. They call it happy juice, but it's Versed, which is like a sedative basically, right? Part of the anesthesia process. They say it helps with the separation and all that stuff, right? He was pretty out of it after they gave him the Versed. But he got the Versed while the like trash truck and those little cars were in the stretcher with him, right? Like in like the hospital bed that they wheeled him away on.
So after he gets woken up out of his anesthesia haze by boo boo time, he does both sides. And then the first thing he says is, where toys? Where toys? Because they had obviously taken the toys away. And he was like, where are these fucking toys, right? Yeah. So I'm like, oh, they took them back, but we're going to go home and play with, you know, more of your toys. We got to get dressed and go home. And he was like, no home toys, no home toys. And I was like, well, no, we got to go home. So he's doing OK. By the way, this child has not cried once this whole time. He's like, you know, he just had anesthesia. He's all discombobulated. No crying. We go downstairs. He's still talking about the toys. And we passed by the CHLA gift shop, and I'm like, okay, you earned it. Let's go in and get you a new toy. It'll support the hospital, and you'll be happy to have a new toy, right?
We get him a new monster truck, and we're leaving the hospital, and he was like, where toys? What toys? And I was like, oh, they're in the waiting room, sweetie, but we're going home. Only when we stepped outside of the hospital, and he keeps saying, where toys? And I said, honey, we're not going back in. Those toys are hospital toys, and we're going home. Then and only then. is when he started crying shanna oh the child kept saying no home go back go back and i have to give chla a bfb because it's like they made it so fun for him that he wanted to go back into the hospital yeah This place that should have been, you know, historically is a scary place for kids and no, he wanted to go back and the only thing he cried about that entire day was the fact that he had to leave the hospital toys behind.
Shanna
Oh, that is hilarious. I guess they didn't think about giving him a little versed for the separation anxiety of the toys at the end of the visit, huh?
Laura
I guess maybe most kids are not as toy obsessed as my boys are.
Shanna
They are. They are. They love their toys and they love their trucks.
Laura
But they really do. Yeah. From the gift shop, I bought him a monster truck. He picked out the monster truck. And of course, when Augie and Corey rolled up to pick us up, Augie was like, what's that? Can I see it? Can I look at it? And I purposely did not buy him a toy because I'm like, look, he has to understand that sometimes you don't always get a toy when your brother gets a toy. So but he did end up riding home carrying the toy because Sebastian was so bereft about leaving the hospital that he just cried all the way home.
Shanna
He did? Oh, wow.
Laura
I mean, he hadn't eaten in 24 hours, so the poor boy was also maybe contending with that. He definitely perked up. He didn't cry all the way home. He stopped crying when we got through the drive-through and I gave him some french fries.
Shanna
Oh, good. I'm glad that erased the memory of his beloved toys that he had to be behind. Well, that's really awesome about Children's Hospital. We've only gone there like once or twice for little things, but I mean, I just hear amazing things about that hospital. Super support that place for sure.
Laura
Yeah. Oh, and I didn't even, I'm not going to go into it because we don't have time, but like they have all these like Disney, like interactive Disney murals on the wall that you like download an app and point your phone on it and it creates augmented reality Disney stuff in your phone. Like it's super cool. Anyway, they've really got it dialed in. So good job, CHLA.
Shanna
Yay.
Laura
But that's it for me. I think that might be it for our show.
Shanna
Yes, except I have a five-star review to read. Oh, good. This is from Rebecca 424F on Apple Podcasts. The title of the review is, We're Totally Friends, Right? Five Stars. I started listening to this podcast when I was 13 weeks pregnant in mid 2021 and binged until I caught up with my own weeks of pregnancy. I continued to binge listen but still went back and played each of the weeks episodes after my daughter was born to coincide with CeCe and Augie's development. I would be talking to friends in real life and mention something from the podcast, whether it be a piece of advice or an Amazon find, and not realize that I would say, a friend told me this or a friend recommended me that. And I would completely forget that it came from the podcast. I have a long commute to work and listen almost every day.
I'm pretty much caught up, but I'm afraid to catch up completely because then I'll have to wait a full week for the next episode. You both are so relatable, funny, insightful, and truly informative. I'm so happy you both have become a part of my parenting journey. Oh my gosh, Rebecca, what an amazing review. Thank you so much.
Laura
And you totally have permission to just tell people you heard it from a friend because, uh, I'd like to think we are friends. Yes! Pod friends. Yes, we are totally friends. But then also make sure you tell them to listen to the Big Fat Positive.
Shanna
Indeed. Listeners, if you haven't had a chance yet to leave us a five-star review, could you please do us a favor and head on over to Apple Podcasts? Leave us a five-star review and say a few things you love about the show, and we might read it on an upcoming episode. If you have any comments or questions about this week's episode or anything else, drop us a line. We'd love to hear from you. Laura, where can they reach us?
Laura
We are on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook at BFP Podcast. We have a website, bigfatpositivepodcast.com. If you want to send us an email, you can always throw a voice memo in there. We love those. Just send them to contact at bigfatpositivepodcast.com. And finally, if you want to join the coolest group of people on the internet, search Facebook for Big Fat Positive Community. It's a private group, so you have to request to join and answer the two membership questions so we know you're not a robot. Once you do that, you'll be sent straight through to all the wonderful and insightful conversations we're having in there.
Shanna
Our show's produced by Laura Birek, Shanna Micko, and Steve Yager. Thanks so much for listening, everyone. We love y'all. Have a great week. Bye. Bye.
